A Hero’s Journey of Hard Truths, High Performance, and Self-Accountability with Joshua Smith

[0:00] Welcome to the REI Agent, a holistic approach to life through real estate. I’m Matthias, an agent and investor. And I’m Erica, a licensed therapist. Join us as we interview guests that also strive to live bold and fulfilled lives through business and real estate investing. Tune in every week for interviews with real estate agents and investors. Ready to level up? Let’s do it.

[0:23] Welcome back to the REI Agent. Today we have a really great guest, Joshua Smith. He is the host of the Get Shit Done podcast, GSD Mode. Sorry, GSD Mode, Get Shit Done Mode podcast. He’s a guy that I listened to before. And he’s motivating. He definitely has really good clarity, good insights. He is in the Phoenix market and is seeing pockets of that market already being in a real estate crash. And he has thoughts and opinions about what may happen with the market, even though… Or he says preparing for the worst while hoping for the best. And he has some insights as to what he thinks could happen throughout the country or certainly in different markets. Especially the ones that saw really high spikes in purchases and institutional investors, etc.

[1:24] So interesting. Definitely something if you are curious about that kind of thing, it’s a good one to listen to. What struck me about him was he seems to have a really good ability of seeing things from a very high level, looking at things from the big picture. Like kind of where do you want to go? What’s the market doing right now? Where’s the advantage in the market? And then boiling that down into processes that will actually get you there. So it is just a really good reminder how in all facets of your life, if you are just focused on the day-to-day actions, life is just going to kind of happen to you. You do have to take that time to kind of think about the market as a whole, your life as a whole.

[2:11] Where do you want to be? Where’s the market going? And what opportunities there are in all those areas. And then systematically go after those. So, yeah, it was a really good conversation. And it was a bit of a longer one. So I’m going to keep this intro a little bit shorter. So without further ado, let’s just jump right into it. Here’s Joshua Smith.

[2:37] Welcome back to the REI Agent. I have the honor and privilege of talking to Joshua Smith today. Joshua, thanks for being on the show. Yeah, thank you for having me, man. Truly honored to be here with you and excited for this. It’s a lot of fun to talk to you. I’ve listened to you. I’ve listened to many podcasts of yours in the past. So, yeah, it’s a fun full circle thing. I think there was a local agent actually that he didn’t, he wasn’t really in my market, but he sold a couple houses in my market that you had on as a guest, which I thought it was kind of fun as well. I think it’s Zayvon. Zayvon? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I’m out of Virginia, so if that puts any context into where we’re talking from.

[3:17] But Joshua, tell us a little bit about kind of your journey in real estate, what got you started, and then maybe how you got into podcasting as well. Yeah, dude. So I jumped in 20 years ago, actually 20 years ago this month, man. So May of 2005, and college dropout, just looking for a way to make money, dude, that didn’t require a college degree, getting into massive debt. And, you know, I’m looking for an industry where, you know, I mean, the reason why I kind of left college and dropped out of college was I didn’t want to pigeonhole myself into something that I didn’t have in this amounts of opportunity. You know, I wanted to have something where I’m always controlling my own fate, control is something that’s important to me.

[3:57] People don’t, some people value it, some don’t. For me, it’s something that’s really important. So 2005, Phoenix, Arizona. I just moved from Michigan to Phoenix. Okay. And I was actually working in the health club business at the time. But same thing there, dude. I love selling memberships, all of that. I love that business. But it was like every time we start making good money, they change our comp structure. You know, so I’m looking for a different vehicle. 2005, dude, real estate market’s just banging, man. You know, the perception to everybody was all these realtors are just crushing it, killing it. Right. You know, so I’m like, okay, I’ll go jump into real estate, you know, two-week crash course, you know, whatever.

[4:30] And, you know, two things there, man. Is number one, I had the passion, the work ethic, like that desire to go out there and succeed. Number two, like I knew, you know, I was 23 years old, never been an entrepreneur before. I knew I needed the right mentor. So I went out there, found an amazing mentor. And they just hit the ground running, dude. So, you know, 40 deals my first year, 103 the second. Then that scale up to a few hundred after that. Just over 320 deals a third year. So that led me into, you know, really scaling and building my real estate team. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. And 20 years later, man, you know, been in it, you know, several different facets from teams to franchising to, you know, other aspects of it.

[5:11] But it’s been an amazing, amazing, you know, I say amazing, you know, goods, bads, ugly, everything in between, you know, but wouldn’t trade it for the world, man. I think about 320 deals gives me a massive headache.

[5:27] Yeah. Yeah. And it’s been, I mean, you know, between just myself, not just myself, but myself and my team, not counting the brokerage side, you know, I’ve done over 7,000 transactions now. So, you know, it’s been a lot of volume. Yeah, that’s amazing. So, I mean, you must be a master at systems and getting kind of your processes down so that you can effectively, I mean, how early were you delegating with doing that many numbers so fast? Yeah. Yeah. So, okay, 48 my first year. I’ve got to remember this is also 2005. So, capacities might be a little bit different today, but 2005, dude, there was no smartphones. Like, we didn’t have scanners. Like, everything was still fax, you know. There was no docusign.

[6:05] There was no. Right. You know, so things maybe took a little bit longer, maybe, maybe not. I don’t know. But for me, it was 48. You know, and I want to double going into the next year, but I was like, dude, I don’t, I’m already working like 40 to midnight. Like, I’m like, there’s not enough hours in a day to do this. So, you know, at that point in time, I hired my first assistant, you know, 40-hour week assistant. I was able to take all the essential non-money-making activities off my plate so I could allocate all my time on the making money. Then that led me to 103 deals. Then from there, now I’m at a point in time where, okay, when new buyer or sellers wanted to, you know, set up time to meet with me.

[6:39] Okay, I’m two to three weeks booked out. People might wait two to three days. They’re not waiting two to three weeks. So, I realized, okay, I’m pissed and we’re in money. You know, again, I hit another glass ceiling capacity. So, I started bringing on agents, you know. So, it only took a year to, you know, leverage from an admin’s aspect. Two years to start leveraging on the agent aspect. And what was that? What agent did you bring in? Did you have specific roles with, like, a buyer specialist showing? Yeah, that was, you know, because back then, dude, again, this was, like, teams weren’t really a thing, you know, like they are today. Like, we didn’t really know. It’s kind of, you know, jumping off the cliff and building the parachute on the way down.

[7:13] Now, luckily, you know, my dad owned and operated gyms for 30 years. So, I grew up in that industry and I built sales teams in gyms. And I, you know, all the way from, you know, doing pre-sales to starting a new facility and building the staff up. So, I had experience with building teams. So, I was just like, hey, let’s just replicate sales is sales, business is business. Let me just replicate what I did over here. You know, so, I’m like, okay, in the gym business, you always hire the admin first so we can focus more on sales. Then you start, you know, slowly adding sales people about the sales teams. You know, then you get out of sales, become the sales manager, you know, right? And then just build the way up.

[7:43] So, I did it the same way. So, it really started off with me with just overflow. I had so much overflow, you know. And most of my business was by side at that time still. Sure. You know, so, now, I’ve never been one that was like, oh, do my agents have to just… Buy side versus sell side. It just happened to be that pretty much everything I had for them was on the buy side, you know, right? So, but just on the, you know, it was just 50-50 split, you know. But, dude, I was providing like 90% of their business where it’s just like, hey, dude, here’s something that needs a house. Go find them a house. Yeah. So, that’s the next question I have for you. I mean, where were you drumming up that much business that fast?

[8:22] Dude, I’m a workhorse, you know. So, I started off doing like, you know, I mean a minimum five upwards of, you know, seven plus open houses a week, you know. And so, started with that. Then, quickly got to a point where I was like, all right, man. I need open houses. I need storefronts. But, I was spending 10 hours a week prospecting for other agents to beg them to do their open houses. So, I realized I was a vulnerability. So, I started going to go after expires. Then, very quickly, I realized, man, I hate cold calling. Like, I know it’s effective. I’m good at it. I get it. It works. But, I just hate it. So, then I had to start coming up with inbound, expired, and other inbound style seller campaigns.

[9:05] Yeah, but target. Not just doing like geo farming, but just like very target direct campaigns. You know. So, really in the first couple years, because I just moved from Michigan to Arizona. So, I didn’t have a spirit. I didn’t even know anybody. You know. So, just sort of building so heavily from, you know, open houses. Plus, with our targeted mailer campaigns of stack and listings. And then, back then, too. You don’t get this so much today. But, it’s like you get a listing, man. Like, you get sign calls like crazy. Open house. You know, right? It was a different time. You know. And different. In good ways. In different bad ways, too. But, that was it, man. I get up until. You know. So, it was really just expireds.

[9:49] Canceled withdrawals. And open houses. Until the great financial crisis. Jumping in 2005. And then, that hits. Right? And luckily, dude. Just doing my expires. Canceled withdrawals. Because I treat them all as like the same niche. Right? Yeah. That didn’t let into. Accidentally. Let into me doing a bunch of short sales. You know. Like, I remember having my first expired. Or my first short sale. Right? So, I go on. And ask. You know. Having a conversation with the seller. Everything’s good to go. Get their home listed. You know. Like, a week before closing. The title company calls me. And they’re like. Well, you know. When’s the seller planning on bringing in their funds? I’m like. What are you talking about?

[10:23] They should be like netting like 18 grand here. Like, what do you. What do you mean funds? Like. Oh, they have this line of credit on the property. I’m like. Dude. That was never disclosed. You know. Right? I had no idea. But so, then I reach out to them. Like. Oh, yeah. We did take out a line of credit. But we didn’t know that that was attached to the house. You know. Because they’re like. We use that to like buy cars and RVs and shit. You know. Right? So. And now, again. Remember. Like. I’m like. 24. 25. At this point. Okay.

[10:52] I didn’t know what I was doing at this point. You know. But so, I stumbled across my first short sale. So, then I was like. Okay. What’s our option? Well. We can go out there. Try to negotiate a short sale. Get a short payoff for that. And. But then it came to. Okay. Every reason things were expiring was because they didn’t have enough equity. Because the market. It’s kind of like what we’re starting to see again here. You know. In my market. And a lot of other markets as well. As. You know. Feeling like 2007 all over again. Possibly even worse. Right? So, then. So, then that led into short sales. You know. So, then I’m like. Hey man. And I just start. You know. I’ve always been a big believer in.

[11:26] My philosophy is always. Okay. There’s no such thing as a good market or bad market. The market’s always good for somebody. It’s our job as professionals. To identify whom the market is good for. Pivot shift. And adapt accordingly. To whom the market’s good for. And I don’t care whether you’re. Representing on the buy side. Or if you’re looking to go out there. And invest yourself. It’s all the same game. You know. Right? You know. So. So, then from there. I’m just. You know. Paying attention to. Okay. Like we’re doing a lot of short sales.

[11:51] We’re all the REO starting to pick up. Well, what the hell is REO? You know. Right? So, start. You’re figuring that out. And we pivot in that. And next thing you know. We’re representing like 35 different banks. Asset management firms. Outsourcers. So, when you talk about systems and processes. Like. Dude. My first few years. I got. Like. You know. 2005. Till. About 2008. I was just a workhorse. Dude. I didn’t have systems and processes. It was just. Let’s just go out there. And freaking grind. But then. When you start getting all these banks. You know. And even. Let’s just say. Okay. Like. Fannie Mae Direct. Right? Well. Then. Fannie Mae Direct. Maybe I’m working with six different asset managers.

[12:27] So, we got Fannie Mae Direct’s. Kind of playbook of how they want things done. But then. Each asset manager has their own operation style. So. You know. So, the next thing you know. We’re working with these. You know. 30 plus. Outsourcers. Asset management firms. You know. Carrying 400. You know. Upwards of 400 assets. Anytime. Like. I had to get damn good. And learn processes and systems. Very quickly. To be able to manage that. Yeah. So. You know. Now. Now. It’s kind of what I’m known for. Is systems processes. Scalability. And I’ve learned to love it. But. It wasn’t. Like. An innate thing. It happened out of necessity. Because it was the only way. Because. Like. Dude. If you didn’t. I remember one year.

[13:04] It was Christmas Eve. When we were kind of new into this. And. Fannie Mae dropped 17. New assignments to me on Christmas Eve. So. I had to go to my whole team. I’m like. Hey guys. Like. My goal is to get you all home by Christmas. But like. We’re probably going to work till like. One. Two in the morning. Oh my gosh. Yeah. Right. Because I get. Like. If they don’t. They don’t. With. With task assignments. It’s like. The task assignments. The task assignment. There is no. Oh. It’s Christmas Day. We’ll give you an extra day. And if you don’t hit their KPIs. Like. You’re fired. You’re done. You know. So. You had. You had a really. Very. You know. Quickly learn. Systems. Processes. Scale. You know.

[13:40] Because then also on those. Now we’re talking. You know. This $300,000. Or property. Is now worth $85,000. Yeah. Right. And the banks are expecting you to take lesser commission. Because they’re giving you volume. So. If you didn’t figure out the volume. In game. And how to manage this at volume. Like. Very difficult to make it in that. That arena. Yeah. I mean. So. We’re. How long were things taking to sell at that point. When you were. Selling the REOs. And the short sales. I mean. They were average. What. A couple months. Yeah. I mean. Got to the point. When we had about 15 months. Of inventory. You know. So. So. You know. A year plus. Now. Yeah. The nice thing about the disposition side.

[14:24] For. For. And. And we do a lot now. With. You know. We represent a lot of big. Hedge funds. And private equity firms. And. You know. Have now. For the last. You know. It’s been a big part of my business. For over a decade now. But. So. The nice thing about. You know. This is like. They need to unload these dude. Yeah. So. Versus a typical seller. That won’t price right. Won’t price right. Yeah. Yeah. My. I mean. Again. Average. You know. Got to a point where. Where inventory due was. 15 months. Whereas it means that the average. Home was taken. A year plus. To go out there and sell. You know. But with. Okay. Pre-foreclosures. Time is of the essence. So we’d have to get them. You know. So most of those.

[14:59] Things we’d have on a contract. Within a week or two. You know. The banks. They would kind of have their. You know. Want to start a little bit high. But they. They. They needed to. You know. Because all the whole costs. Were just astronomical for them. They needed to unload these. Just like when I’m working with Blackstone. And they’re. You know. With their dispositions team. It’s like. Hey. Like. We got to unload these. So they can’t. Hold on to them for a year. Like. They’re under. Unperforming assets. Like. We got to unload them fast. Right. So. It was a little bit different. Than maybe a traditional realtor.

[15:29] You know. Just out of curiosity. I mean. One thing. You mentioned that you think that. You know. Things could be even worse. Than. Coming up. If. If you are a person. That’s also interested in investing. In real estate. And you. Are a realtor. That has access to these banks. Or sets up systems. Or looking to get into that. Is there any kind of. Conflict of interest. Or any kind of. No-nos. With wanting to buy. One of those. Assets that comes up. As an REO. No. It’s just. Like. Look. I’m living in a. Fannie Mae house. That I bought from Fannie Mae. It just. Okay. There was restrictions. Where if I was a listing agent. I couldn’t acquire it. So. It was like. Okay. This listing comes up. You know.

[16:04] I could just give it to another agent. Or have them reassigned to another agent. You know. So. You know. Because I like to. You know. Buy one. Things are at the bottom. And then. You know. Yeah. So. So. Then. Yeah. So. So. You know. And every bank’s going to. Or every institution’s going to be. Like. If I’m working for a private equity firm. They don’t really give a shit. As long as their number’s their number. Now. Some of these like government sponsored entities. The GSEs. They might have some more red tape. Well. And sometimes. They want to have it be like. You know. They want to have two weeks of time. For a primary residency. A resident to buy. That kind of thing. Right. Yeah. So. So. So.

[16:40] I got into. I started. I got my license in 2014. To give you perspective. So. I was kind of probably at the. I mean. Honestly. I feel like it was like the perfect time. To. To. To learn. In a more balanced market. That was kind of starting to pick up. And then have experience. By the time things really were rolling. I’m curious. What indications you see. In your market. That make you believe. It is. Possibly going to be worse. Or a similar kind of crisis. Yeah. Look. So I was just speaking on stage. About this yesterday. I was a few hundred agents. Here in Phoenix. I was at an event for. And. And a couple things to understand. Number one. Real estate is very hyper local. So even like. GFC. Like I have friends in Alabama.

[17:19] That. You know. Run large real estate companies. That are like. Hey. Our market went down 2%. Where in my market. You know. I had $150,000. Acre parcel of land. That now we’re selling for $5,000. You had homes. That were $600,000. Now that we’re selling for $185,000. Right. So our market got demolished. When I say our market. Phoenix, Arizona. That was. And this time. That was during the GFC. Okay. Yeah. You know. Right. So yeah. Like okay. You know. Like you know. House that was. Like prime example. Like maybe it was. $550,000. $575,000. Peak 2025. Or 2005. The bottom. You know. $180,000. $175,000. You know. And then it took us. Dude. It took from 2005. Peak. 2012 was the bottom. Back to 2019 though.

[18:03] To just get back to 2005 pricing. Okay. So if you look at the historic average. Usually for down cycles. It’s about a 10 year recovery period. Right. From again. Peak to valley to correction. That one was a little bit longer. But that was. Again. Not all markets. Like every market can be different dude. Right. So there is no like nationwide. This is exactly what’s going to happen. You know. But then from there. Like I was telling everybody. I’m like look. The best way I found that. To.

[18:30] Plan for business. And just protect yourself. Is hopefully the best plan for the worst. I’m like dude. I don’t have a crystal ball. I have no idea what the hell is going to happen. You know. But I am prepping and planning for this to be worse than the great financial crisis. And there’ll be worse than the great depression. You know. Because if we look at. Look again. I don’t know what’s going to happen with. Who knows. There’s so much manipulation. I mean. If you look. We should be in an 18 year long depression right now. Like if you remove away all the deficit spending. And just the manipulation of the markets. And really just a freaking Federal Reserve in the printing press. And then being able to.

[19:00] You know. Right. You know. Like if you remove. Like we would be. If you look at. Year over year from GDP growth. Outside of manipulation. We’d be in like an 18 year long depression right now. Like I don’t think that anything was corrected in the great financial crisis. I think they just unplugged holes. And now when you look at the global debt market. You know. When you look at. You know. Corporate debt. Government debt. Consumer debt. Like. Dude. I don’t know if there’s any way out of this. Yeah. Right. Like who knows what’s going to happen. Global default. Debt jubilee. Who the hell knows. You know. Right. Right. But what I do know here for the U.S. Is. If you go to Federal Reserve. St. Louis.

[19:34] Which is the Department of Federal Reserve. That’s responsible for tracking what’s going on with the consumer. And then just go. So go Google. And you must watch. And it says. Federal Reserve. St. Louis. Consumer debt. Versus savings chart. No point in time in recorded history. Have we seen. You know. Debt to savings. Like the gap be this wide. Or accelerate at this pace. Like the average person. Is way worse off. Than they were before the great financial crisis. And way worse off than they were before the great depression. So. So. Again. I don’t know. There’s too many. There’s so much. Like. Yeah. Dude. Who knows. Man. The Federal Reserve might step in. And buy 90 billion dollars a month. Of mortgage backed securities.

[20:10] Again. And manipulate the market. Autoreficially prop it up. But if they let the market. Do what the markets are going to do. Yeah. This thing is going to get fucking ugly dude. You know. Right. Now. That’s going to. You know. Like. Okay. Like. Arizona. Florida. Texas. Yeah. You know. Parts of Nevada. You know. Atlanta. There’s definitely areas. Are going to get ripped apart. Much harder. Than. You know. I mean. Typically. The markets that went up the fastest. Right. Go down the fastest. And then there’s also a direct correlation. To ban. You know. Based on. You know. Investor acquisitions. Versus. You know. Because investors will just start unloading. Like. We’re already sitting in our market.

[20:48] Dude. Like. I mean. I went for. 2012 to 2022. With investor clients. You know. Acquiring 20 plus properties. Every single month. Like clockwork. You know. These are big institutions. That we’re representing. Right. Yeah. Okay. Cost of capital goes up. They’re stopping now. To now. We’re just unloading. And just. You know. And I was looking at like. Watch what smart money’s doing. You know. Watch. Watch what. You know. Blackstone is doing. Watch what. Ron Buffett’s doing. Watch. What are they doing right now. With their money. Yeah. Right. Yeah. It’s a pretty good tell of. You know. Because they’re. They’re going to be protected. They’re going to get the hell out. Before it’s Joe Schmo. It’s us regular.

[21:22] You know. Peasants that get caught. Dude. Right. So. So. So be cash heavy. You know. And I. Again. I mean. I’m not. You know. I’m not going to tell anybody. You know. I’m just. Walk through what I see. What I pay attention to. You know. With that. And then like. Okay. You know. I’m not personally. I’m not going to say anywhere. I wouldn’t. But. Definitely not my market. Am I going to be a buyer in this market. You know. But what I do tell. Because I still have a lot of. You know. Clients that want to do it. Even though I’ll tell them. Like. Hey dude. Like. Why don’t you just go put that in a T-bill. For some time. Guarantee your 5% interest. You know. Right. 5% return for some time. Until. You know.

[21:58] Because in my market. Again. Every market is doing different things. But. We got prices coming down. At a very fast rate. We got cap rate. Compressions happening. For the first time. In multiple decades. You got 10 evictions skyrocketing. Then we got hold costs going up. You know. Taxes. Insurance. HOAs. Cost of maintenance. I’m like. Dude. It makes zero sense.

[22:18] Go out there and buy and hold. Unless you get an absolute steal. But then from there. Okay. Even when we’re talking with people. I want to flip. Or you know. Like get in the flipping game. I’m like. Look dude. Like. Again. Hopefully the best plan for the worst. Okay. Worst case scenario. If you cannot get this thing moved. Can you live with it? Yeah. Right. Can we get somebody in there. At least cash flow a little bit. Or break. Like. Can you live with worst case scenario? And if you can’t. Then don’t freaking do it right now. Dude. Because I’ve just. I’ve seen it too many times. Where people get stuck. They got. You know. I was just having a dinner the other night. With a friend of mine that.

[22:47] You know. Is a. Not a massive investor. But a pretty. Pretty avid investor. Right. And you know. He recently just got stuck. In this recent downturn. With 22 projects going on at once. Yeah. Lost. I mean. I mean. We’re talking like eight figures. An eight figure loss of everything. Wow. You know. So. Yeah. I’ve definitely heard a lot of. Horror stories. Or veterans. Or people that went through the last downturn. Holding. A property. That. And I’m not talking last downturn. I’m talking. God. Yeah. We’re talking 2022. And going on. I got hit. Yeah. I hear you. I. We’re not. Our market’s not there. For sure. We’ve. We’ve still seen. Increase in prices. And we still have. You know. It’s. It’s. It’s not as much of a seller market.

[23:33] But it is. Still. Somewhat. You know. I expect most of my listings to go under contract in three days. Usually. A little bit over asking price. It had one go crazy over asking price. 20%. You’re like. Northern Virginia. Not quite. We’re. We’re like a tertiary market. Underneath. So. Two hours south of D.C. Okay. Yeah. Which. Which. Which. That. The proximity to D.C. Helps. Some of our prices and stuff. But we have a university town that. Kind of keeps the economy rolling. But. But yeah. I’m. I’m just saying it. Like. It could definitely. Catch up here too. As well. It’s just definitely different. From what you’re describing. Well. Many even. Like. We see even pockets within the pockets. Right.

[24:16] So it’s like. Okay. What could be happening here in Maricopa County. In Phoenix Metro. Obviously. Can be different than. You know. And not even Virginia. Virginia Beach. Can be totally different than what you’re seeing. Right. Right. But then from there. It’s like. Hey man. We have a couple pockets within Phoenix. Not a lot. But about 5% of the markets out there. That are still crazy. That are hot as hell. Man. But it’s like. Okay. 95% is melting down. Like. You know. We’ve got many zip codes. When I say melting down. We’ve got many zip codes that are already. Already technically in a real estate market crash. Because a crash is just 20% beyond. You know. The peak. Right. So if we look at. 2022.

[24:51] When we peak to now. We’re already beyond. You know. 20% correction. Which would technically be a crash. What’s weird about this time too. Dude. Is. Like. All the pockets. I’m seeing. Not just our market. But even throughout the countries. That are staying super strong. Is. Is. The luxury market. Where luxury is always kind of. If you look at. The last year. A hundred years of real estate. Like. Luxury has kind of led the slowdown. But I think that. And again. I’m just talking out of my ass. Like. I don’t know. But you know. My guesstimate on this is. Because we are going through. And continuing to. Go through right now. We’re. You know. Have been for. Last. What. Three. Four years now. Continuing to go through this.

[25:27] The biggest transference. Of wealth in history. I mean. So we’re seeing the middle class. Just be eliminated. Yeah. Right. And there’s no need for it. There’s no. You know. There. There. The industrial revolution is done. We’ll see if it comes. You know. But there’s. Like. So it’s either. It’s the haves and have nots. You know. Where it’s like. People are getting poor. People are getting richer. Yeah. Right. So. Yeah. Like. Like. If you go in my market. Like Queen Creek. You know. Paradise Valley. You know. Which is the most. Fifth. Expensive zip codes. In the. The United States. Like. Those pockets. Are freaking staying. You know. Multiple offers. Staying super strong. Where it’s more like.

[26:01] The middle class markets. That are just getting destroyed. Are they. Are they often. Cash. I would assume. They’re. They’re at least. Heavily cash. Like. So the. The interest rates. Aren’t applying as much to them. Do you think that’s part of it? Yeah. Yeah. Well. Yeah. I mean. That’s part of it. Plus. They’re just. You know. When you’re seeing. You’re seeing the wealth transferred. It’s just. People are making more money. Or they’re making less. You know. And it’s people I talk to too. Friends. You know. Whatever. It’s like. They’re either. Financially doing the best. They’ve ever done their life. Or they’re getting ripped apart. In a way that they never have. Now. That’s like. One percent.

[26:34] Versus. Ninety. Ninety. Ninety. Ninety. Ninety. Ninety. Ninety. Ninety. Ninety. Ninety. Ninety. It’s the most unenforced time to be alive. And as a U.S. Citizen recorded history. We’ve never had a point in time. Where it’s been more expensive to just operate and live life. Than what we’re seeing now. At any point in time. And since 1776. Right. And then even when you look at real estate. Like even in the early 80s. When interest rates were 20%. You know. Close to 20%. It still was more affordable to acquire real estate. Than it is now. Yeah. That’s one thing that people often will bring up. Like. Oh. The insurance rates have been higher than this before. But like. Yeah. But the affordability of the house.

[27:06] Like the purchase price was at a price. Where the payments were more affordable. Yeah. I know. That’s kind of a silly point. Or a misleading point. Maybe. Well. I guess. I guess. With all that said. I mean. You’re talking about. You know. Hoping for the best. Preparing for the worst. How do you prepare for this possible downturn? What steps? What actions? Where should you focus? Your future. You know. Growth. In. To be prepared for this kind of possible downturn. You know. I mean. Get lean. You know. You want to be able to move fast. You know. Right. So. Like. Great Warren Buffett says. When the tide goes out. You see skinny dipping. Like. Make sure you don’t get caught skinny dipping.

[27:46] You know. So. You want to be fluent. Man. You want to be able to scale. Move fast. Right. You want to be the speedboat. Not the Titanic. You know. Which I know is harder. You know. For. Depending on the level. That we’re at in this business. But. You know. Do your best with it. Then from there. Man. Just keep the eye on the ball. Man. Make sure you’re tracking everything. Keep your eye on the ball. So that way you can shift and pivot. So example with this. You know. People were coming to me in 2008. And they’re like. Oh man. I’m having to get out of business. Nobody saw this coming. And. And I was like. How did you not see this coming? Like. I’m not going to lie. That I didn’t know the severity of it.

[28:19] Right. But I’m like. You know. But. Like. And I didn’t realize this at the time. But I had a great mentor. That taught me how to read and track markets. So it’s like. Every single month. I’m tracking. You know. Where inventory. Greater growth of inventory. I’m like. Dude. We had 31 months of straight inventory. It was a slow progression. Month over month incline. But like. You’d had to. Totally have your head buried in the scene. And not know that we weren’t transitioning. Into a. You know. To a heavy. Heavy buyer’s market. Now. Maybe you wouldn’t expect Lehman’s brother. And Bear Stearns to collapse. And for it to go to the free fall that it did. You know. But I was like. Hey man. Before that already happened.

[28:51] I was already in with 30 banks. And. And. You know. Short said. Like. You know. Because we’re paying attention. So make sure you’re paying attention to the market. Again. Because. It doesn’t matter. There’s no such thing as a good market or a bad market. The market is always good for somebody. I always look at real estate is. Is. We got like a science experiment. So if you look at the control. The control is a piece of real estate. That is my job. Is to move that piece of real estate. Again. Whether I’m helping a client. Or if I’m acquiring it. My job is to know the real estate. To move that. Like to know the product and be able to move the product. The variable that will change throughout. You know.

[29:21] All of our lifetimes. Our careers. Is who’s buying it. Who’s selling it. Why they’re buying it. Why they’re selling it. Where they’re coming from. Where they’re going. So as long as I’m always paying attention to that. And I’m able to pivot shift. You know. And adapt accordingly. Based on my focus. My prospecting. My marketing. So like. Here’s an example. Dude. Like with my market. You know. We went from being the fifth most affordable metro in the United States. To being the top five least affordable. So home. That’s maybe 800 today. You know. Seven years ago. It’s 300. So locals. Like. Like household incomes haven’t went up. Barely at all. You know. So like locals. I can’t afford it. They’re like.

[29:54] Screw this. So I’m like. Okay. Well who’s our market good for? So I know the top 10 states. I know the metros within those states. And then within those. Then I know the pockets. Where hey. Our market is a win for. So like. Like let’s just say. I’m running ads. Which I do a ton of. Like Facebook ads. To San Francisco Bay Area. So they’re living in a 1300 square foot. Three bed. Two bath. 100 year old house. That they don’t ever feel safe. Living in their own neighborhood. Because of all the crime. And homelessness. And whatever. This is their words. Not mine. So they’re selling that for 1.5 million. They’re coming out here. Buying for eight. Nine hundred grand. What feels to be a mansion. 5,000 square feet.

[30:29] Brand new. Gated community. You know. Like. To them. They’re like. Holy crap. We cannot believe. Yeah. That this is even a possibility. So. So this is what we got to always be pivoting. Okay. Like. Who’s your market of win. It’s always a win for somebody. It’s always good for somebody. You know. So making sure that you’re just. Being fluid. You know. Those that. That get ran over. Those that just stay in the same place. Man. Like. You gotta. You gotta move. You gotta pivot. Yeah. That is definitely true about this industry. Is that things are rarely the same. And you have to just kind of keep. Yeah. Keep your head on a swivel. And keep. An eye on where things are going. And try to. Keep up. That’s a.

[31:06] Yeah. That’s really. That’s fascinating. I’ve actually. Considered doing similar kind of ads. To Northern Virginia. Because I think a lot of people have. Been. Dreaming of living in the valley. In a bigger metro area. Simpler country. Kind of life. You know. And. There’s been. A lot of job cuts. And it might be the time. That. People might want to be. Transitioning to. A more. Simple life. But. Yeah. That’s awesome. And it starts with awareness. Right. If they don’t have awareness. That you exist. That you’re an option. They’re not going to go there. Yeah. Right. So. Right. You know. We got to make sure we have that right target approach. You know. And just. Again. Always looking at. Like I said.

[31:44] 2000. So. Okay. If we look at the journey. Right. 2005. To 2008. 2007. 2008. Was. Heavy traditional. Buyers expires. And that pivoted very quickly. Into. You know. Short sales. REO. Well. In 2011. Short sales REO. Starts. You know. Slowing down. Now. Don’t get me wrong. I’m always still doing some traditional business too. It’s just. Yeah. Short sales and REO. Might have been. 75. 80 percent of it. Still. Like. There’s no point in time where you’re banning all of it. Well. Then all of a sudden. We start seeing short sales and REO. Like. Starting to dry up a little bit. Okay. Well. Again. Who’s buying? Who’s selling? Where’s the market going? So. Now. I started seeing all these hedge funds. Imitation homes.

[32:23] Coming in and buying. You know. Next thing I know. I’ve seen this. This company called. I never heard of them. Imitation homes. Buying 500 units a month in my market. Yeah. Right. I’m like. Okay. Like. How do I get in with them? Yeah. Right. Now. You got to figure that out. You know. Right. You got to go in. And. And so. Okay. How do I get in with imitation homes? Next thing. You know. We’re doing 60. 70 units a month with them. You know. So. Then. Okay. Like. Traditional. Hasn’t picked up yet. Short sale and REO are coming down. Well. Our institutional investors were going up and up and up. You know. Well. That lasted for so long. Then that started coming down. REO and short sales was still going down.

[32:55] But then. Traditional started picking up. You know. And. And then. Dude. Like. Like. Like. For. Like I said. 2012 through 2022. You know. We’re doing 20 plus acquisitions a month through Blackstone. Well. 2022. When the Federal Reserve goes from quantitative easing to quantitative tightening. Because a lot of people think that these big institutions pay cash for them. They don’t. They’ll have a direct line with the Fed. Or. Or. You know. Direct line with whomever. Goldman Sachs. But then that is based on the overnight. You know. Fed. You know. Overnight rate. So. And they go from like 0.5% to 5%. And they’re buying these at 5% cap rates. Like. And it’s a floating rate. Pretty much. Dude. They’re.

[33:31] They’re done. So. We went from overnight. You know. 20. You know. 200 plus transactions on an annual basis. You know. To like. Hey. We’re just done. We’re stopped. Now. Luckily. I’ve been through this enough times. And I put all my eggs in one basket. So. We’re able to be fine. We’re still able to let you know. Go out there and move. Or. You know. 700 homes a year. You know. And adapt. But it’s like. You always got to be adapting. So. Then we start adapting. Okay. Well. Big money’s stopping at acquiring. How are local investors doing? You know. Because for me. You know. For the longest time. I didn’t want to focus on like. The onesies and twosies. With the investors. Right. But then we started assessing.

[34:00] Okay. What’s going on here? So. Now. For the last two. Three years. Man. We’ve just been stacking up listings. On the acquisition side. Or the disposition side. Because investors. Just getting crushed out here. You know. So. This is where you just always got to pay attention to. Again. Like. What’s going on in the market? Where’s the opportunity at? Because my job. Again. Is. My job. Is to know the product. And move the product. Yeah. Right. Then from there. All the other crap’s always going to be changing. And when you’re. When you’re looking at. These types of investment. Buyer. Sellers. Was that any multifamily as well? Or is that primarily like. Single family. Condo. Townhouse. Kind of thing.

[34:36] Yeah. For. For me. For us. For our market. I have a lot of. You know. Clients of mine. Agent partners. I should say of mine. That are in areas. Where multifamily is very popular. Yeah. Here in my market. Dude. It’s. It’s. Not that it’s not. But it’s. No. I mean. We’re pretty much all. Single family. Yeah. Same here. But. I know that. A lot of people got. Held. Like. Got caught. Like holding. Bridge loans. And not. Not projecting the rates to go the way they did. From when they. You know. Underwrote the deal for the beginning. So. That’s been a bloodbath too. For a lot of places. Not that everybody’s. You know. There’s definitely people that are still doing well. I think also. You know. When you’re looking at.

[35:20] Investing. And putting your money into different things. Keeping. Mind. Of what could happen. Could also. You know. Help determine what kind of asset class. You might be looking at. You know. For example. If. If you wanted to. If numbers still looked. Pretty good. Without aggressive projections. On a mobile home park. For example. That might be more recession proof. Than buying something. You know. Like. I don’t know. More luxurious.

[35:46] Townhouse. Or. You know. I don’t know. It’s. It’s all. Definitely. That’s going to be. There might be more pressure. To. Or demand. Coming to those kind of places. The cheaper. The rent. Etc. Then. You know. Something that might be. A higher rent. In the. Side. But. Yeah. I’m curious. If. Well. Let me ask you quick. You’re. You’re obviously. A very driven person. And. And do crazy things. You’ve. You’ve been doing this podcast. You’ve been selling. All these houses. How do you keep your mind right? How do you. Take care of yourself? I know. You still exercise. What. What all do you do? Yeah. Dude. You know. So. I’m. I’ll do my best to answer this. Because when people say. To keep your mind right.

[36:34] I don’t know if there is. You know. If there is. Yeah. I was thinking. I’ve been thinking about this a lot. You know. Like. Just over the years. Of like. All right man. Or. Is it that. We’re all individually. Super messed up. Or is it that. Hey man. There’s really nothing messed up with us. We’re just trying to fit into this. Messed up fucking world. Yeah. Right. So then we have all this. You know. Like. I don’t know. And I’m not going to pretend. You know. I’ve got my issues. Don’t get me wrong. You know. But yeah. Health and fitness is a big aspect of my life. You know. I allowed myself. To become extremely depressed. You know. Where just. Daily consumption of my thoughts. Was just around committing suicide.

[37:10] And that all led to me. Getting more of the obese. Next thing you know. I’m 300 pounds. Close to 300 pounds. And. And. And when I was trying to overcome. You know. The depression. I was like. Okay. Well. It’s the opposite of depression. Okay. We got fulfillment. Then I’m sitting there thinking. Okay. Like what would make me fulfilled. Like what would make me happy. I’m like. I don’t really know. But then I was like. Okay. There’s two areas in my life. That. I’m pretty sure that. If I could get these. Dialed in. That put me on the right path. Number one. That was. You know. I was a college dropout. Never made more. Ten dollars an hour. Sick and tired of being broke. Number two. So I was like.

[37:42] Okay. If I could figure out. How to start making some more money. You know. Number two. If I can get my health dialed in. And not be absolutely ashamed of myself. Every time I got to look in the fucking mirror. You know. Right. And actually have energy. And so I just went to work on those two things. You know. That led me into sales. And it led me. You know. Into real estate. You know. Led me on my. You know. 100 plus pound weight loss journey. And. Yeah. You know. So. And you got to. You know. You got to lose it. And you got to keep it off. And. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And you know. Part of the health and fitness stuff. Is probably because. You know. I grew up as the. The chubby fat kid. Man. I had two older brothers.

[38:16] That were very athletic. Very in good shape. And don’t. Like. They beat the living shit out of me. And bullied the crap out of me. Plus. You know. Kids are mean dude. So. I was like. You know. You know. You know. I don’t want to say bullied. Outside my brothers. But. You know. My buddies always made jokes. Right. Sure. You know. So now. I’m like at a point in life. Where like. Dude. If I can’t see visible abs. Like. I feel like shit about myself. And I don’t know if it’s a. You know. There’s probably some issues there. But I’m like. Hey. Why fix them. Right. It forces me to eat super clean. Forces me to work out like a beast. Like. Forces me into having healthy habits. You know. If I were to sit down and talk with a therapist.

[38:49] They’d probably be like. You’re broken in so many ways. But I’m like. Okay. Fix me in the ways that don’t serve me. But then let me stay broken in the ways that serve me. Is the way I look at this. So. Yeah. So. You know. I’m very diligent with health and fitness. You know. You know. When COVID hit. Man. I. You know. I was always a gym rat before that. But when COVID hit. No gym. So. I set up a home gym. Which now. I love. So I’m able to get up early. Work out. You know. Eat the same five meals pretty much every day. You know. I’m very strict with my diet. And not just from an aesthetic standpoint. But I’ve also found of. Okay. What foods give me good energy. What foods make me lethargic. Or put me to sleep.

[39:26] So I know. You know. Like. Like. Just. I want to optimize for output of. And not just for business. But for. You know. I want to have energy when I’m not doing business too. Right. Yeah. You know. So that’s kind of workout diet. And then. I don’t know. I can’t remember what the original question is. So. Well. I mean. Yeah. I mean. That’s. That you’re answering it. I mean. I think like. I. When people ask me. The same kind of question. Like. Kind of. How do I keep myself going. How do I keep my mind right. How do I. Blah. Blah. Blah. I often turn to. Like. Well. I go to the gym. And there’s definitely times that. I. I don’t want to talk to a certain client. I don’t want to. I don’t want to. Respond to a message.

[40:02] Until I’ve gone. Because I’m like. This is just not going to. I need. I need to go there process. Or. Not process. But I need to get. My mental. My stress out. You know. I need to get. A more clear headed. And once I’m done with the gym. I’m going to be able to. Respond more diplomatically. The way I hoped I would have. That kind of thing. So. It’s. It’s. You know. That’s a huge part for me as well. At what point in this. So. So. You. You kind of started your business. And fitness. Kind of journey. At the same time. Did you also. When did you. You said you’re married now. Right. You have a family. When. When did that start for you. So. Met my. So. High school sweethearts. So. We met. 16. Got.

[40:42] You know. Married in. 2005. Serving kids. Pretty much. You know. A few hours. A few years after that. So. I had our first child. In 2008. So. We’ve been together for. You know. Pretty much. Our whole lives. Dude. Right. So. I mean. You just started everything. 2005. Yeah. Yeah. But we met. You know. 16. So. I don’t know. Fuck. What. That was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was.

[41:21] It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. It was. I’m more obese. Massively out of shape. To pretty damn good shape. I’ve competed in bodybuilding.

[42:22] I’ve been in pretty damn good shape. You know. Now both. Had. Different pains in different ways. But both came with immense pain. Right. So then it’s like. Dude. Just pick your fucking pain. But don’t be delusional thinking that. Either path is going to be easy. Because there is no such thing as easy. But you got to just. What is the pain that I want to go out there and experience. And. And. You know. It’s like when people ask like. What do you. What do you do to keep your mind good? I’m like dude. I had nothing. Is a good mind. People are like. You know. I’m like dude. I have days where I wake up. Where I’m. I’m motivated. I’m ready to go. I have more days. Where I’m fucking pissed off. I want to stay sleeping.

[42:58] I’m demotivated. I’m depressed. People come to me like. Oh. I’m like. What’s our goal? I just want to be happy. I’m like. I get where you’re coming from. From that. But that is a bad. That’s a terrible goal. Right. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m.

[44:49] I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m.

[47:10] I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m.

[49:31] I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m.

[51:52] I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m.

[54:13] I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m. I’m.